He is married with six children, according to a church profile. Bishop Scott Jones moves from extreme center of UMC to new Global Methodist Church, Jesus Revolution leaves out the tough stuff but gets the music right, From Super Bowl ads to Kentucky revivals, stop the Christian cannibalism, Saddleback Church doubles down on support for female pastors, Holy Queer author seeks Black church inclusion beyond singing with choir, More Jesus, less touching: 14 changes to the Mormon temple endowment ceremony, Real Housewife Heather Gay pens a juicy ex-Mormon memoir, How to stay Mormon after a faith crisis (if staying is what you want), Copyright 2020, Religion News Service. If it would not crush my parents, I would have used quitmormon already. situation with a family member in hospice care. clear conscience. Runnells' beloved grandfather passes. I have done nothing wrong. Also, the confidential nature of our meeting FairMormon made direct personal attacks on me, my integrity and my character in their response. Ivins also decided to keep the original gentleman's agreement to meet on March 15, 2016. No answersjust threats of excommunication. It mostly deals with historical issues surrounding the time of the founding of the LDS Church in the 1820s and 1830s, although it does talk about more modern issues as well. Actually, it is the slang for a 6 cylinder car, namely a 1968 Triumph TR250. You stated at the end of our November 2, 2014 meeting that you were not a historian but that I have invited my two counselors and if you so choose, feel free to invite Sister Runnells to attend. the free agency of members of the church. Just a quick thought on excommunication. You are asking me to limit and to obstruct not just my own free agency but the free agency of members and investigators of the church who also share the The following is an audio recording of the entire first meeting: Transcript of the above recording is available in HTML here(Opens in New Window). Your demands were disturbing Runnells publicly announces the latest updates (screenshot): Many of you have emailed me or contacted me to ask for an update on the LDS Church's Excommunication attempts against me. will respect this request and the Handbook by not attempting to hold a disciplinary council against me in my absence and inability to defend myself. Many wonder if the If he repent not he shall not be numbered among my people, 3Ne. questions and concerns, the church demonstrates that it really is not interested in balance or any real and meaningful intellectual conversation on the President Ivins assured Runnells that he wanted to help, and that he would obtain answers. Earlier today before the Press Conference, Runnells received a job proposal from the LDS Church. Being excommunicated means that membership has officially been revoked. If the church seeks to suppress negative facts being discussed in the Mormon marketplace of information and to excommunicate those who have doubts, Guess whatever the "additional information" that just demanded a Valentine's Day disciplinary court be held against Runnells wasn't that urgent or important after all Ivins asks Runnells to verify that March 15th informal meeting is still on. taken down and you will stop distributing your materials about the Church to others. I believe that members and investigators deserve to have all of the facts and information on the tableto be able to make a fully-informed and balanced decision as to whether or not they want to commit their hearts, minds, time, talents, income and lives to Mormonism. Wait a minute. Natasha Helfer received the news of her excommunication from her Salt Lake City-based church on Wednesday in a letter written by Stephen Daley, a regional church official in Derby, Kansas. I expect this matter to be handled with respect. He never responded as promised. [16] This is inconsistent with a non-random, unscientific survey conducted by Podcaster John Dehlin indicating that, among self-recruited survey respondents, historical reasons were a factor in 70% of former members' decisions to leave. I will be out of the country between March 25, 2016 to April 5, 2016 and will have very limited, if any, access to email and phone. Mormonism and excommunication By EditorUpdated on Jun 19, 2014. This is especially true in light of my verbal and written promise and willingness to Any disciplinary action against me without giving me errors or mistakes to publicly correct along with the opportunity to publicly correct and repent of But the world has changed in the Richard Lyman, who held the rank of apostle in the church, was excommunicated in 1943. Those who do leave over historical inaccuracies, according to her research with Benjamin Knoll, are a smaller, vocal, and growing group. Last meeting ended with you stating that I'm a good man and that you would look for The CES Director read the letter and promised a response to Runnells' questions and concerns. '"[25], Harris, M. L., Bringhurst, N. G., & Mauss, A. L. (2020). In my letter that I handed to you in the beginning of our November 2, 2014 meeting, I wrote: "To the best of my knowledge, everything posted in the CES Letter and on my website is completely accurate and solidly based in Church history. Please let me know if there is anything I or other members of the stake can do to assist you and your family during this challenging time. I for one, CAN'T WAIT TO HEAR IT!!!! If we have not the truth, it ought to be harmed." and the first century C.E., long after Abraham lived." Please disregard the notice you received by mail today regarding the disciplinary council scheduled for February 14, 2016. to legitmate questions and doubts through proper church leadership channels. 4. Accordingly, as long as your hearing problems persist, I think it will be better for us to communicate back and forth in writing, which is also what you An in-depth look at every individual excommunicated by Jesus Christ in scripture, High-profile excommunications may harm Mormon retention rates in the long run. Most Chapel Mormons would be disturbed and shocked at the new Mormonism that these unofficial apologists mingle and preach with Jeremy lost half of his hearing six months ago. It either occurred or it did not occur. Functional cookies help to perform certain functionalities like sharing the content of the website on social media platforms, collect feedbacks, and other third-party features. sincere concern and a teacher bore his or her testimony as a response intended to avoid the issue.". Later that day @ 2:45pm, CES Letter Foundation issues another press release announcing the postponement: As you know, we ended our November 2, 2014 meeting on a good marketing spend in 3 years: $0. You attempted to place conditions on me by demanding that I take down everything and to move our conversation into the dark. Runnells decides to redirect the conversation from verbally via the phone to writing This is a kangaroo court. Yes family and friends have abandoned me. - adultery, rape, spousal abuse, child abuse, child molestation, or whatever other despicable evils left to the In the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church), a church membership council (formerly called a disciplinary council) [1] is an ecclesiastical event during which a church member's status is considered, typically for alleged violations of church standards. disturbing. that you still do not understand the background and evolution of the CES Letter. Why is it wrong for me to publish issues but not for them? This website uses cookies to improve your experience while you navigate through the website. So, hopefully tonight the church will answer the questions that they've been ignoring the last 3 years. and website. FairMormon made outrageously false claims in their attempt to discredit both me and the CES Letter. It is a way to avoid people claiming they didn't know about the court. was telling you were "anti-Mormon lies.". The church's essays are discrediting the church. And good comeback. and this one. will not take place on Valentine's Day. Indeed, the church would be telling the world it fears the very questions I am asking. Excommunication is a disciplinary per the Church's definition. with Church doctrine, updating and translating those concerns into different languages, etc. Legal Fund. What have I done wrong? doctrine.". It also takes a lot of resources to help those who have questions and who are trying to liberate themselves and their loved ones, while keeping their dignities intact. bunnzy, The term also provides us an apt visual for what went down on Sunday evening, when the witnesses for Natashas defense werent even allowed into the church building. questions and concerns to him in writing as part of his effort to potentially resolve my questions and concerns with the Church's origins and history. He's asked to have a deaf interpreter. - Jeremy Runnells, author of the popular Letter to a CES Director (also known as CES Letter), has been summoned to a disciplinary council at 7:30pm; please confirm your attendance. It is up to the discretion of the presiding authority. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, LDS - The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, Third Hour Forum Rules - Please be familiar with these rules before posting. new window while listening to the audio recording on this page. In the event, if any, that a third disciplinary council is set up against me, I will be sure to let everyone know. in the beginning of our November 2, 2014 meeting, I am also copying/pasting the relevant part that helps to answer your question: I didn't wake up one day and decide to create CES Letter and cesletter.org. attempted to mislead the people, then he should be exposed; his claims should be refuted, and his doctrines shown to be false" - President Joseph Fielding Smith, "That is the way I feel about it. What errors or mistakes in the CES Letter, or on the website, is incorrect so I can publicly correct it? It's my understanding that there's several of you who have come I am resigning because of the way the church treats me and other members who have sincere questions, concerns, and doubts. But it is not part of a permanent file, so to speak. My wife committed adultry and she had a bishops court but the decision was to put her on formal probation. It shackled you with the notion that the world was dark and lost for the express purpose of preventing you from seeing its light and findings your own way. being treated as a member and I withdraw my consent to being subject to church rules, policies, beliefs, and "discipline". interested media, along with supporters of Runnells, are invited to attend and show support. distributing your materials about the Church to others" is to censor sincere questions as well as hard facts and truths (and its open discussion in the [17], In November 2020, FairMormon released a set of 16 videos[18] responding to Runnells, meant to appeal to Millennials and Generation Z. This means the papyri did not come from Abraham's own hand as Joseph and the church claimed the last 175 or so There are TL;DR boxes listed in each section. Clear editor. However, if it continues, there are some that will issue a letter stating that a court will be held to determine their membership status. "These fragments date to between the third century B.C.E. against me. Ivins replies back to Runnells' March 10, 2016 @ 3:04pm email with the following 5:02am email (screenshot): I appreciate your response to my email. Disturbed and disgusted with the LDS Church's unfair, unjust, and un-Christlike treatment toward him along with the LDS Church's and Stake President's refusal to answer sincere and reasonable questions, Runnells ultimately made the decision during his disciplinary court hearing held on the evening of April 17, 2016 to resign and remove his name from the records of the LDS Church. Take notice that several of the above quotes invite and encourage investigation. My well-meaning mother has told my 19yr old sister that if she moves in with her boyfriend that she is a candidate for excommunication. Jeremy Runnells, Author of CES Letter, Faces LDS Church Excommunication FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CES Letter Foundation Phone: 801.609.8301 Email: media@cesletter.org Jeremy Runnells, author of the popular Letter to a CES Director faces excommunication from the LDS Church on charges of apostasy Again, it is not me or the CES Letter itself that causes people to leave, if they do, but rather the facts and information verified by the church's own But on Tuesday, the church was thrown into the limelight after it announced that it had. My wife and I were sealed in the Temple yet she only received a formal probation. to believe in during the 1980s and 1990s never really . me. Again, I will be bringing my trusted interpreter to ensure that I understand 100% of everything that is said in our meeting. imagination of members who hear excommunication because of "conduct unbecoming a member" and "additional information"). The LDS gospel topics series: A scholarly engagement. I entertained the answers of unofficial apologists. It has validated and confirmed to me that this is an organization that prizes, above all, obedience and conformity over morality and integrity. Jul 13, 2010 at 12:30 am. Ivins responded with See attached Jeremy Runnells' Temple Recommend Interview PDF to see my answers to each notice will be delivered to you regarding the scheduled disciplinary council. members feel learning these troubling facts for the first time after a lifetime of discipleship and faithful study of correlated church history. Fortunately, Elder M. Russell Ballard gave a recent talk to the Church Educational System this seen as nothing short of Orwellian. Related A professor at a Mormon university was asked to retract a pro-LGBT Facebook post. These cookies will be stored in your browser only with your consent. questions with you as well as hearing your answers to my questions. The recordings and emails speak for themselves. nowit's a "privilege to work with [me]"? Such an event is rare, particularly for a church official of such high standing. that the church does not have answers. the Mormon marketplace of information. Truth stands boldly and unafraid; it is not shaken by testing or investigation. It just feels I am resigning because I absolutely resent and am disgusted by the LDS Church's and President Ivins' treatment toward me and their attempts to spiritually 98 votes, 33 comments. I have done nothing wrong. Smith and the real origins and history of Mormonism. But you authorities on the subject have an answer I'm sure. Being a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS/Mormon) is not a feeling of identification or affiliation, it is an actual membership record. sides of its mouth - professing open and honest dialogue, yet punishing those who choose to participate at that level. Sam Young, once a bishop in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, has been excommunicated for criticizing the Mormon practice of sexually explicit "worthiness" interviews with young . It is not only the disturbing facts that trouble members, it is the betrayal An evening when all the men in that room, including yourself, should be spending with their loved ones. A few weeks later, President Ivins abruptly cancelled the March 20, 2016 disciplinary council. Press J to jump to the feed. It appears that you and the church are attempting to kill and silence the messenger rather than address the message. It was done in a way that was a business approach to a soul who had been educated since primary (Mormon school for children on Sundays) th. A vigil for Jeremy Runnells is being organized on Sunday, April 17, 2016 @ 5:30 pm Mountain Time at the American Fork Utah East Stake Center. Fortunately, the Church has made inroads toward more transparency since then by publishing its new on the issues troubling so many Latter-day Saints - a conversation, by the way, these Mormon apologists started and initiated first with their attacks Religious societies have the right to deal with members disorderly conduct, D&C 134:10. Posted on Jun 18, 2014 This month (June 2014), two Mormons who have been critical of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints received letters from church officials threatening them with possible excommunication. I have already answered and rebutted this accusation against me in my March 7th letter to you. It is my sincere hope that your next email to me will contain answers that I have been asking you for - many times - over the past year and a In fact, most of them have created versions of Mormonism that directly contradict the First Presidency's and Quorum of Twelve's version of Mormonism. last generation - with the access to information on the internet, we can't continue that pattern; I think we need to continue to defend myself vigorously. electronic or otherwise. You ask: "Explain your seeking funding on the internet to address and develop new material related to your concerns that you have with Church Photo by Jody England Hansen. you feel qualifies me for a "court of love". My goal has been to get official answers from the I don't know how to repent of church essay verified facts. We want to be in the position to help, and you can help make that possible. Runnells was shocked as he was expecting the meeting to be a continuation of their November 2, 2014 meeting where Ivins would follow up and return to Ivins then blindsides and shocks Runnells with his following email sent two hours later @ 9:36pm (screenshot): Bro. Truth is often found in the most unexpected places. "As the letter shared by Ms. Helfer indicates, the decision of the local leaders was based on her public, repeated opposition to the church, church leaders and the doctrine of the church, including our doctrine on the nature of the family and on moral issues," Hawkins said in a statement. CES Letter Regardless, I wish to express gratitude to President Ivins for his offer to hold an informal meeting in March before any disciplinary court to explain to I prefer the old-school term excommunication, which is more accurate in its ramifications. with dignity and therefore my resignation is effective immediately and unconditionally. These unofficial defenders of the church and their pet theories are no more legitimate or official than the wacky pet theories and claims of that weird old All you who speak so authoritatively on the excommunication topic, explain this: a friend of mine was an adulterer, boozer, and liar. seers, and revelators all pointing to God himself as the source and gatekeeper of the ban. Your link has been automatically embedded. Runnells reports that he met twice with his LDS Stake President, Mark Ivins, in the fall of 2014. the blessings of the Temple because of what the Race and the Priesthood There is a great deal of legislation concerning common-law marriage, child custody, property ownership and contractual services. I'm really touched by that. month where he acknowledges this: "Gone are the days when a student asked an honest question and the teacher responded, 'Don't worry about it.' responses to FairMormon. Former bishop for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints Sam Young, reads his excommunication letter after he protested the Church's one-on-one worthiness interviews with young children . In that letter and the excommunication letter, King did not mention same-sex marriage or female ordination among the reasons. But according to Spangler, thats apparently what this stake president did, communicating to the witnesses left outside in the parking lot that there would be one hour allotted and no more. #worstvalentinedateever. - "[4], When his grandfather heard of the doubts Runnells had, he put him in contact with a CES institute director, who suggested Runnells write a letter with a list of his concerns. If you resign, then you reclaim power over your life but the reality of the close-knit culture of Mormonism and the result of years of leaders reinforcing the idea that apostates are immoral and under Satans influence means that the Church still gets the parting shot of controlling the narrative of your exit. Jeremy arrives at the American Fork East Stake Center @ 6pm and gives the following statement to the crowd gathered in the church parking lot before walking into his disciplinary council: Thank you all for coming tonight. I have always been committed to the CES Letter being accurate and up-to-date. Born and raised in Southern California, Jeremy is a seventh generation Mormon of Pioneer heritage who reached every Mormon youth milestone. agreement by pushing to excommunicate me for reasons I did not know or understand. Is this really a legitimate reason for excommunication? answers. | Enlighten the World. And the specific questions that I asked are: And you have not answered a single one of them.". So, two disciplinary councils were set up and cancelled. But now, after the press release, press conference, media interviews and tremendous reaction/response on social media, he is willing to move it back to the And on page 61 in a discussion on excommuniation, it discusses sending the name-removal letter to Church headquarters: "In cases of excommunication the same records are sent to Church headquarters along with the following items when applicable: 1) The letter written by a person requesting that his name be removed from the records of the . They are unofficial men with unofficial pet theories and unofficial claims that the LDS Church Runnells responded that since Ivins was unable to disclose the purpose of the meeting, Runnells was unable to get in a car to show up at disciplinary court on me: conduct a Temple Recommend interview. (screenshot): Dear Brother Runnells - Thank you for the email and the expression of your feelings regarding your current situation. A main theme of the letter is the belief of Runnells that the church knew unflattering aspects about its history but deliberately hid or misrepresented them. But go ahead, bash away. In 2015, John Dehlin, a Mormon blogger who criticized church leaders and teachings in podcasts, was excommunicated for conduct contrary to church laws, though he denied having committed apostasy. Ivins hesitated and then reluctantly stated over the phone, "This is in regards to your membership in the church.". If we have not the truth, it ought to be harmed.". Second, the Handbook is clear that the accused is allowed to have witnesses. It's pure, willful and conscious dismissiveness on the part of church leadership. In other developments in the Chad and Lori Daybell case, it seems that Chad Daybell has been ex-communicated from the LDS Church. You may as well appeal; voting opposed, pointing out issues, and letting others know why one votes opposed really shouldn't be death sentences and that is the reasons given for the excommunication, meaning those are the best reasons that could be determined. Or even holding a council? had suggested in an earlier email. Here is Fox 13's coverage of Jeremy Runnells and the press conference: LDS author says he faces excommunication after writing 'Letter to a CES Director'. LDS Church members have reached out to Runnells after reading the CES Letter. Prior to sending my 80 page letter to the CES Director, I shared the letter with folks on Facebook and Reddit for editing and feedback purposes in my CES Letter represents Runnells' sincere attempt to obtain answers to legitimate questions and doubts through proper church leadership channels. recovering from and am half deaf. It appears as though you are unwilling to take down simply the philosophies of men mingled with scripture. And the 3rd question I asked you is: What question am I being punished for? "So, because you guys are not answering my questions, and you guys have not answered my questions the past 3 years, it is very clear to me that the church does not have answers to its truth crisis. As for your claim: "You have stated in the past that you had no desire to hurt the Church or its members. For starters, its unclear to me why this disciplinary council was happening in that stake in the first place. Our whole strength rests on the validity of that vision. last generation - with the access to information on the internet, we can't continue that pattern; I think we need to continue to presented to me in our first and only October 19, 2014 meeting before today's November 2, 2014 meeting. censored due to the personal nature of the details and names of individuals, locations, and events involved. I believe in the Mormon Marketplace of Information.". FairMormon I'm done with this court. members. [7][6], According to Runnells, after attending a fireside by Marlin K. Jensen in 2012, he became aware that some members were losing their faith over historical issues. The. I have desperately tried to get official answers from the church to these serious problems for several years now. Runnells' response to Ivins' above March 6, 2016 @ 8:19pm email is the following 11:45pm email (screenshot). If you can have your letter or email to me by March 10th, I will try to respond by March 15th. I have done nothing wrong. - President J. Reuben Clark, Truth is unafraid of light, questioning, investigation, and scrutiny. In a normal month they usually process 500-1000 over the course of that entire period. all over again. This never happened. It is worth bringing up current Church Historian Elder Steven Snow's comment again: "I think in the past there was a tendency to keep a lot of the records closed or at least not give access to information. The artist, Ryan Ottley, also released a statement saying, "My entire family are members, as are many of my friends, and I would never include anything mean-spirited about them or their beliefs. As mentioned above, the CES Letter went viral online because of other people who also share the same questions and concerns I do, independent of my as grounds to justify holding a disciplinary council against me: I will now respond to each one of your above accusations: I have already responded to and rebutted this accusation in my March 6, 2016 letter to you. I wanted to make sure that the church's essays meetings. Translation and Historicity of the Book of Abraham essay. I do very much look forward to our appointment on March 15th to discuss exactly what it is that you disagree with and exactly what it is that The very next morning President Ivins emailed Runnells to inform him that the Valentine's Day disciplinary council was rescheduled for March 20, 2016. modern Egyptologists. I trust that you will be honorable and Mormon marketplace of information) about the church's foundational truth claims, as verified and confirmed by the church's own essays. Why still no answers? Why won't you and the church just answer the questions? After all, there are many Mormons who leave the church after going to FairMormon in an The No trouble or expense at all. call ended with Runnells telling Ivins to have his secretary call him around March 15th to schedule a time to come in. You are asking me to remove my defenses against personal and dishonest attacks against my name, integrity and character. It has been replaced by an Orwellian system that values unquestioning God himself refuses to trammel free agency even though its exercise sometimes teaches painful You have already demonstrated your still does include my interviews). filled with fear and its house is built on sand. After reviewing your website and your statements, there are pam. I believe I have answered all of your questions. Total I was always curious as to what level a court is required. CES Letter was my response. attempt to get answers to their doubts and concerns only to find more questions and issues than they had to begin with. "[19] Runnells responded to the videos in a Facebook post, reposting a video calling them a "dishonest smear campaign". It was a vicious I have approached other Church leaders for official answers. After excommunicating the LDS Church, Stake President Mark Ivins, and their kangaroo court from his life by resigning, Runnells emerges out of the Stake Center to address the crowd. ", "I'm not discrediting the church. The bishop is appointed to be a judge in Israel, D&C 107:72. correct the errors or mistakes on my website for all to see. In fact, I credit FairMormon for helping to make This pattern of applying 20th century censorship and control tactics in a 21st century social media connected world is The real question here is if the church really believes in and is confident in its foundational truth claims to welcome hard investigation and scrutiny. (Toto, Helfer isnt in Kansas anymore. 7:15pm at the Stake Center. If you decide to do so, please send me a written statement specifying the alleged errors or unfairness in the procedure or decision. This past Friday, Williams released this Open Letter to LDS church leaders in response to the planned disciplinary hearings for apostasy by Kate Kelly for organizing the day of action. is ever brought to my attention that there are any inaccuracies in the CES Letter or on my website, I am totally and
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